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October 4, 2006
Condo of the Day: The Mill Building
We were talking to a (non-Corcoran) broker the other night who was contrasting Toll Brothers' lack of understanding of the Williamsburg market (as evidenced by the 8-foot 9-foot ceilings in North 8) with the spot-on aesthetic of The Mill Building on North 3rd Street. We haven't been inside either, but we are excited to see a condo project that wasn't afraid to keep the original factory floors in place, regardless of their "imperfections". (He also mentioned what a broker dynamo Kara Kasper is, but that's another topic.) For those of you who have been inside The Mill Building, do you think the developers did a good job of preserving some of the original building's original charm? It looks like prices are about $600 a foot which seems okay for the location and quality. Agree? Disagree? The Corcoran site shows 17 listings still available, which means that a lot of the units have already sold.
85 North Third Street [Corcoran] GMAP
Photo by justiNYC
Comments
First of all, if you go the mill website, you see 21 units available, besides that, Corcoran never releases all available units at once, look at any of their projects and you will see for your self.
Posted by: mentch at October 4, 2006 11:42 AM
Haven't been inside, but they've been doing a nice job on the exterior (you can see in this photo the one strip of the building that hasn't been cleaned). Nice windows, modest additions (cabanas!) up on the roof - there is one existing "greenhouse" up there that always looked like an ideal penthouse.
Posted by: Halden at October 4, 2006 12:05 PM
you may have that backward. it is the developer that 'releases' the units or lists them with the brokerages.
Not the brokers holding back on the listings.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 12:06 PM
Not true, 12:06. In the trade, brokers love to call this 'inventory control.' Rather than flood the market and give the impression that buyers can wait to pick and choose, they release a few of each type, hoping to force the buyer's hand.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 12:27 PM
I vowed I'd never buy a Toll Bros. home so I haven't paid attention to North 8. But 8' ceilings? Really? And they're a luxury builder. Seems very budget to me.
Anyone who buys one is crazy.
Posted by: anon at October 4, 2006 12:44 PM
I believe the North8 ceilings are almost 9'. Not exactly loft height, but more reasonable than 8' to be sure.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 12:58 PM
the maint is too high! way too expensive for the burg
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 1:16 PM
I visited both properties on their first day of sales.
I was unimpressed with the Toll Bros building -- it seems that they don't understand the audience here and what's appealing. I also thought the apts were overpriced.
I was very impressed with the Mill Building. Unfortunately, the reasonably priced apts with great layouts and street views were taken the first day. The apts that remain are $1MM plus, or look at a brick wall. For those willing to make major compromises, they're probably still worthwile to check out. As an fyi, the doorman is not full time, and the parking is not included (they plan to rent monthly, and eventually move to selling the spaces).
One additional note...the Corcoran realtors at the Mill Building were very rude. Their demeanor was that they were doing the buyer a favor. This may unfortunatley work in a hot market, but can't be the foundation for a long-term relationship. Also, on the first day, one of the realtors (who comes across very green) mentioned that parking was included and that the building will be receiving a significant tax abatement (both are false). My friend, who ended up buying in the building, also had the same horrible experience with the Corcoran realtors.
Posted by: mytwocents at October 4, 2006 2:18 PM
1-The doorman is full time, the super is not.
2-Why would parking be included? The garage is to be a rental.
3-The real estate taxes are a little more complicated. The taxes they quote are the current taxes. They may actually increase first and then decrease. The J51 abatement is a little complicated, but there is probably an abatement in the future. Even if they go up to the projection in the prospectus, they will be far less than the unabated taxes at almost every new construction.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 2:30 PM
kara kasper is a hottie as well as having a catchy name
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 4:13 PM
My friends lived here when it was a rental. I appreciate they kept some of the raw elements of the original space, such as the exposed beams and wood floors. Seems like they left the layouts pretty open too.
That penthouse on the roof was always very cool. No one has lived in there for years.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 4, 2006 4:45 PM
Oh good, it's that creepy poster on acid.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 1:28 AM
seems a bit incongruous to one week cheer 'green' buildings and the next decry lack of ceilnig ht (as in more cubic feet to heat and cool).
But as they say, Toll brothers may not understand their market here - sometimes a smug hypocritical one.
Posted by: Anonymous at October 5, 2006 11:31 AM
the mill buidling website is updated.
www.themillbuilding.com
Posted by: brooklyn 2 at October 5, 2006 11:37 AM
my boyfriend and i just bought in this building, luckily before the 2nd increase went into effect a few days ago. they did a great job, it's beautiful inside. we took it even though we have a lovely view of a brick wall. nothing in the area comes close size wise for the price and all the new developments in the area look like they could be in any (crappy) city. the realtors are not nice or helpful but who cares, it's 1750 square feet!
Posted by: Anonymous at October 6, 2006 3:04 PM
Nice conversion, however few units have an awkward layout. I have looked at 1750 square feet units, listed initially at 830K and two weeks later the price was updated to 950K – not sure will go for 15% increase!!! Is the Corcoran group getting too confident in this soft market?
Posted by: highjinx at October 11, 2006 11:08 PM
Have you bought in the Mill Building in Williamsburg?
I was a back-up buyer but did not get the apartment. I would like to talk to a buyer who might be interested in selling an assignment of their contract, pre-closing, with the Sponsor’s consent. Price is negotiable. I would also be willing to cover a reasonable consent fee to the Sponsor. This is a serious offer from a private buyer—I’m giving you an opportunity to walk away with a substantial amount without ever having to close. Please drop me an email if you are interested. Thanks.
Whitney@nycmail.com
Posted by: Whitney at November 5, 2006 9:09 PM
What are you buyers being told for a move-in date?
Posted by: Anonymous at November 5, 2006 10:49 PM
I have purchased a 4th floor unit that has a projected move in date of May/June.
I don't know how realistic that is, but typically most projects come in after their stated completion dates.
Posted by: ANOTHER ANONYMOUS at December 7, 2006 5:29 PM
The Milol Building has many problems. I was in constuction for NYC for 16 years. Check out the official NYC Dept of Buildings website for this building
http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/PropertyProfileOverviewServlet?requestid=10&bin=3062363&restore=1
If you scroll down the web site of the NYC Dept of Buildings Property Profile for The Mill Building,you will see 3 categories --- Complaints, DOB(Dept of Buildings)Violations, and ECB(Environmental Control Board)Violations. Some of the excessive 83 complaints might have come from a disgruntled person, however the 46 DOB Violations with 37 open, and 41 ECB Violations with 22 open, were issued by the DOB after inspectors came to the building. They were issued by the Dept of Buildings. These violatiosns include the boiler and elevator, and failed safety tests. According to the DOB website. the sponsors have failed to file for some required construction permits, and there exists among many violations, an unsafe building shed. The web site also states that dangerous and unsafe construction practices exist and many of the violations are listed as "High Severity." As far as I can see there has been "Default" or "No Compliance" in many of these violations with fines imposed which are still outstanding.
What does this all mean to a potential buyer? A buyer can not legally move into a building until it has a C of O, or at least a Temporary C of O (TCO). It will also be very hard to get a bank to issue a mortgage after the bank does "due dilligence" on the property and finds the property has numerous violations and no C of O. Even with a Temporary C of O a time limit of 3 months is imposed for the curing of violations. The final C of O will not be issued until all violations are cleared and fines paid. In light of this, I would seek a "date certain" from the sponsor before handing over any big money and making a commitment to this building.
Post a Comment
Posted by: hard hat Harry at December 21, 2006 8:45 AM
Does anyone have anything good to say about the Mill Building?
Posted by: anonymous at January 2, 2007 8:19 PM
Violations are the housing equivalent of parking tickets. You don’t foreclose on a property over violations like you don’t go to jail over parking tickets.
Not being able to obtain a CO on a project is EXTREMLY rare and has NEVER had anything to do with old violations. I only know of 4 scandalous cases where a developer had serious problems with the application for a TCO and they ALL had to do with the same concept of being “overbuilt” on a lot. They were all “new” construction. They were all “self-certified” jobs. And they were consistently coming out of the same 2 architect’s offices. And even in those extreme cases 1st- the buyers were granted the right to rescind. And 2nd the developers ultimately got or are getting their paper work from the city.
This building has to be THE MOST UNLIKELY site to have a problem obtaining a CO in all of Brooklyn. It is a highly respected architect. Nothing was self certified. There is ZERO new construction on this site so it couldn’t possibly get overbuilt.
Posted by: aj at February 16, 2007 10:42 AM
Violations with respect to safety are in no way the equivalent of a parking ticket! Public safety is at stake and serious violations will indeed prevent the issuence of even a TCO. TCO's are issued when a building is substantially in compliance with the submitted plans and only minor violations and unpaid fines remain. A review of the building code violations on the DOB's website, regarding the Mill building, reveals that many, more than minor violations remain open. This building has 37 open DOB violations and 23 open ECB violations. If satisfactory inspections have been made, why haven't these violations been cleared? One building code violation relates to a penthouse on the roof, built without a permit. The likelihood of a TCO being issued while a violation like this is outstanding, is remote. Buyer be careful and get any promises in writing for legal occupancy within a resonable period of time.
Posted by: Concerned Citizen at February 21, 2007 8:36 PM
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