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November 13, 2006

House of the Day: Going Back to Cali

house
You know we've been around awhile when we've witnessed the full lifecycle of a house, from a guest post on the construction process to post on the finished product to the house changing hands for the first time. Such is the case with 112 Butler Street. This very modern new-build in Boerum Hill received a very warm reception from readers when we displayed when we wrote about it last May. After less than a year living in the house, the owner and his family have decided to move back to their home state of California. The house (which is somewhere between 2,500 and 2,800 square feet) is now listed with Corcoran for $2.25 million. There's no way around the fact that this expensive for the location and the square footage but it's certainly worth a shot given the house's unique design. By comparison, the 14 Townhouses, arguably in a better location, are priced at $2.65 million and have about 1,000 square feet more space but no garage. What do you think? Do they have a shot at this price?
112 Butler Street [Corcoran] GMAP P*Shark
Behind the Facade at 112 Butler Street [Brownstoner]
New Build Odyssey [Brownstoner]

Comments

this is VERY cool house. but i don't think i would like living with that back of the house. i'm too much of a privacy freak.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:10 PM

professional flippers. House looks great though.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:12 PM

How close is this house to the area that has been hollering for more protection from drug violence lately? I seem to recall seeing a report in the local paper that the Pct captain had promised better, and that the area near the projects there fell on a pct borderline that was conjectured to be part of the resurgent 'problem.'

Posted by: Brenda from Flatbush at November 13, 2006 12:13 PM

they've got a shot

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:18 PM

not the borderline pct street or area.
This house is west of 'projects' toward Smith St. on fairly quiet block.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:26 PM

Very cool. The problem with the floorplan in that the owner's duplex is pretty tight, and they have laid out the access to the top floor rental in such a way that it would be a big job to try to access it from the duplex. It would be much more appealing if they had created an easy way to connect the top floor to the duplex, which would give the owner the easy option to use the whole house. Other than that, I love it.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:27 PM

This place must be all of 40 feet from the projects on Hoyt.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:31 PM

What a stupid question to ask. Almost as stupid ass the idiots who answer it.

Posted by: Ed at November 13, 2006 12:32 PM

I'm not sure the 14 townhouses are the best precedent since puzzlingly few of them have sold.

The asking price is still high and they have been on the market for a long time. Why doesn't the developer cut the price?

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:36 PM

Run for your lives! Ed is back, and dumber than ever!

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:36 PM

I've been sitting on my stoop chatting with homeless people.

That's a step up from this, troll.

Posted by: Ed at November 13, 2006 12:39 PM

wow, I really like this (and I am a brownstone freak), I must also say that the garage is a bid plus. Still, I would not pay $2+million for it. $800 a square foot - dont think so!

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:41 PM

recent article
http://www.nydailynews.com/boroughs/story/469139p-394809c.html

for 2+ Million, I would would want a relatively safe haven for at least 10 block radius around my home/investment.

Posted by: jake at November 13, 2006 12:44 PM

well in Brownstone Brooklyn a 10 block radius you are not going to find.
Eliminate all Carroll Gardens, Cobble Hill, Boerum Hill, most of Bklyn Hts.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:49 PM

How about a 3 block radius, then... this is way too close to those projects to pay over $2MM. if you have kids you would have to be crazy to live here

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:53 PM

That would be a "NO". I think the market's response will be similar to that of...

http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&ListingID=841878

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 12:55 PM

Folks, it's a two bedroom house (with rental). Who cares about the area? That's why the price is nuts.

Posted by: west at November 13, 2006 12:59 PM

Gee Wiz, do any posters actually ever look at this neighborhood. Must mean that no one wants to go to dinner on Smith St. since it's 1-block from the propjects. The only neighborhood in downtown Brooklyn that is not within 4-5 blocks of a project is Brooklyn Heights.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 1:04 PM

Cute and dull/ cookiecutter "Dwell" reno.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 1:07 PM

"The only neighborhood in downtown Brooklyn that is not within 4-5 blocks of a project is Brooklyn Heights."

Is that why it's such a comatose retirement home for the aging trader?

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 1:10 PM

Certainly tough to price...not many modern houses to compare and very few with parking. Sorry to hear that owners didn't love NY enough to stay longer.
Some brand new floor thru 2bdrm condos for sale across street for sale for $695K - nice but not in same league as this house. I know the block/area well/many years. (its pluses and minuses). I don't think house is large enough for this price.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 1:35 PM

Why is everyone such a hater?

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 1:38 PM

There is an influx of young people in BH staying at the St. George - it changing the face of the area.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 1:39 PM

California Dreaming on a winter's day.

Posted by: crouchback at November 13, 2006 1:56 PM

>>> "Must mean that no one wants to go to dinner on Smith St since it's 1-block from the projects"

There are lots of restaurants in the Village I'd go to dinner at. It doesn't mean I'd want to spend $2m+ to live next to an NYU dorm.

Besides, this house isn't a block from the projects, it's literally the second property west of Hoyt St.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 2:15 PM

What is with the floor to ceiling glass windows? I saw a new building on Myrtle that had the same thing this weekend. Are exhibitionists taking over Brooklyn? I don't want to see what goes on inside my neighbors houses. I like the fact that I can't imagine what they look like naked. Put up some curtains folks...

Posted by: Oh Lord! at November 13, 2006 2:17 PM

I understand comments on this HOTD and other HOTDs - about your individual priorities - that you don't want to live this close to project... or highway or this or that neighborhood.
But in trying to determine how well a house is priced is not based on your or my individual taste or preferences---old vs. new, 1 - 2 or 3 family, blah blah blah.
It is whether market can find buyer at what price. So what are the comps? What else has sold close to here - and what kind of props? Doesn't matter if you or I would want this particular house or location.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 2:55 PM

"There is an influx of young people in BH staying at the St. George - it changing the face of the area."

Oh, you mean the people who leave beer bottles, food and vomit on the sidewalks. BH IS THE BEST nabe in brooklyn. Yes, not everyone can afford to live there but it is still a great area.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 3:15 PM

i think you're wrong brownstoner, this is a much better location than 14 townhouses. the location of 14 townhouses sucks, who wants to live in downtown brooklyn. i happen to like the design, but who wants to live in a house if the 13 next door are identical. that works in the suburban developments, but those house aren't over $2.7 (despite the fact that they haven't sold prices have gone up??) if they'd done the same 14 townhouse in different locations they would have all sold by now.

Posted by: anon at November 13, 2006 3:32 PM

There are houses that have sold for more than this in a 3 block radius recently (up into the 3MM range even). This is so unique and beautiful (if you're a fan of this type of architecture). I think it will fetch this price, esp. with the garage. No, I have nothing to do with this listing.

Posted by: renogirl at November 13, 2006 3:40 PM

if this were a renovated "brownstone" everyone on this board would be talking about the "details" and "old world charm" that there is just no way to put a price on.

the reality folks is that good quality new construction, which this may or may not be, should have a market value of no less than double a renovated brownstone on a per-square-foot basis. all the details and old world charm in the world do not outweigh the knowledge that your house isn't going to just rot away one of these days. so, yes, of course this is in the ballpark. unfortunately, it's in the ballpark of the smart money, which is currently on the sidelines.

Posted by: anon at November 13, 2006 3:48 PM

Speaking of 14 Townhouses. They seem to have disappear from the Corcoran website. Off the market??

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 3:58 PM

good question about 14townhouses.
On their website - still shows corcoran as the contact. But on Corcoran - other than the 1 listing in contract - the other 13 are gone.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 4:08 PM

I'd pay $2M with all furnishings included.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 4:42 PM

does anyone know if this was a pre-fab construction from dwell? i predict the price will drop to 1.85m and someone will snatch it up then.

Posted by: anon at November 13, 2006 4:47 PM

3:48 pm -- the reality is that "good quality new construction" is a contradiction in terms.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 5:15 PM

"the reality is that "good quality new construction" is a contradiction in terms"

of course, nothing built after 1895 could possibly be any good!

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 7:22 PM

My name is Andrew Giancola. I am the owner of Giancola Contracting. I operate a third generation general construction firm. I am a first time poster and I am not anonymous. I do not beleive that my comments can be qualified or deserve merit unless I am willing to be forthright and honest. It is very simple to post comments anonymously. I would be very surprised if most of you would make the comments that you do if you listed your names or buisnesses.

I would like to say that I am in no way affiliated with this home. I didnt build it and I don't know the owners. However, I recently completed two buildings. Both of which were featured(i use the word lightly)on brownstoner...and of course, true to form, they were bashed. It's dis-heartening to me that many posters (there are exceptions) can be so insulting and petty. How old are many of you? Are children making these posts? I am 36 and have been in this industry for 6 years. My firm does brownstone restoration, brownstone renovations and complete gut re-habs of brownstones. I appreciate the old world crafstmanship that exists in many of those buildings. I also applaud many of you who managed to restore them back to there original condition. I have the utmost respect for the few of you that have managed to keep them looking beautiful in there original condition. However, many of them are dark and narrow with awkward room configurations(not all but quite a few). There are also many restrictions for improvements due to "Landmarks". -- Just a side note, I have nothing against Landmarks, because without Landmarks it would be the wild west...with no way to preserve "Brownstone Brooklyn".

That said, my personal taste is more modern and contemporary. I want to bring developement and diversity to some of the more edgy neighborhoods. It can't hurt the realestate market by pushing the envelope and building in area's such as Gawanus. I recently finished a building on the opposite side of the "projects" -- on Bond between Degraw and Douglas...by the way, lets not forget that there are many good, working class families in those "projects" (why does everyone refer to the projects like a cancer).

There is a fledgling community developing in that area. Families, with children who couldnt afford some of the more affluant areas in Brooklyn. Those families are now profiting from the growing realestate market in those areas. Just as many of you who bought your beatiful brownstowns for 700,000 15 years ago.

Why shouldnt this seller try to capitalize on that growing market. I visited this home for the open house and was very surprised at the quality of the construction and attention to detail in this home. It is absolutly beatiful to look out of the back of the house in to the garden. The southern exposure lets in a tremendous amount of warmth and sun light...and yes, there are roll down curtains. Trust me, I don't want to look at my naked neighbors either. It is very posible to have quality new construction. I take tremendous pride in all the work I do. I pride myself on being better than rest and developing something that I can be proud of. Something that will evoke inteligent converstion and debate.

I applaud constructive
criticism...infact, I invite it. Please be aware of other peoples feelings and know that someone who took pride in what he does, built that house. A family lives in that house -- that house is a part of a living, breathing community which you so easily dismiss.

There are many decrepid homes on that block that deserve half of the TLC that this owner invested in this home.

Posted by: Andrew Giancola at November 13, 2006 8:23 PM

Well said Andrew.

Many people on this site are very bitter and mean spirited and entirely too quick to post nasty comments. It likely stems from their own insecurities.

These are peoples homes and there should be some common courtesy and humanity extended. Its one thing to say a particular look doesnt appeal to you or a home is overpriced - but to denegrate a home b/c its not your style for no other reason but to hear yourself type is entirely too common on this site.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 8:35 PM

Thank you for posting here, Andrew. Perhaps if more people with actual knowledge and experience do that, AND sign their names (imagine that!) the quality of the discussions on this site would vastly improve.

Posted by: Jeanne O'Brien at November 13, 2006 9:04 PM

I'm a tratidioanlist, but it is hard not to say that this was an exceptional renovation. Harder still however to understand who the buyer is for a $2.25 million 2-bedroom duplex with a 2 bedroom rental. At $2,500 per month the rental could service about $425K of mortgage. That leaves you at about $1.825 million for a way cool 2 bedroom duplex. I just don see it.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 10:36 PM

Pace University houses some of its students at the St. George.

Posted by: OldMillBasin at November 13, 2006 11:30 PM

Andrew,

Remember when people who didn't like you told you to your face and those that did were allowed to speak?

Welcome to Brooklyn 2000 when the inmates are running the aslyum.

Robert Scarano

Posted by: Robert Scarano at November 13, 2006 11:42 PM

Andrew,

First of all, this is a blog. That means that it exists for individuals to express their opinions. I don't believe it is a site intended for marketing of any properties.

It seems to me quite obvious that the folks who complain about the comments on this site have financial interest in continually increasing real estate prices, such as yourself, or the many brokers, agents and sellers who constantly say things like "These are peoples homes and there should be some common courtesy and humanity extended..." or "I applaud constructive
criticism" which is short hand for " i applaud anything said that will help me sell property that I have developed..."

Face it, while people do live in all of these homes, they are also, for many, their largest and most leveraged financial asset. The notion that you can think in financial terms (ie) return on capital in your business, but we as bloggers shouldn't seems to me a bit disengenuous. You tell me that you haven't walked into a property and thought to yourself, or said to your associate, "this is overpriced, or in a bad location, or ...." Well that is exactly what Brownstoner allows us to do as well. if you can't stomach it then you shouldn't read it. I am sure you will, however, because it will give you an idea of what people think about this market.

Obviously the seller has the right to maximize his/her return. But you should also agree that the buyer has thr right to be informed before making a purchase. Brownstoner helps to inform, so "hate the game, not the player!"

Posted by: Anonymous at November 13, 2006 11:44 PM

Hi Andrew,

Could you please post your email address or email me at araczyn@yahoo.com I have a question about your bond St project (very nice building btw). Thanks in advance

Adam

Posted by: Adam at November 14, 2006 7:09 AM

"Brownstoner helps to inform"???? To some extent . . . but:

"i predict the price will drop to 1.85m and someone will snatch it up then"

"for 2+ Million, I would would want a relatively safe haven for at least 10 block radius around my home/investment."

"I'd pay $2M with all furnishings included."

These are helpful??? This site is filled with 20% useful/informational comments, and 80% comments by haters who are no doubt sitting in their futon-filled windowless one-bedroom apartments, looking longingly at their movie/liquor poster adorned walls.

As soon as someone puts up a house with detail (whether it's one's style or not is another debate) that might actually be worth some money, the well-informed academics come out of the woodwork.

Posted by: dcardoni at November 14, 2006 9:38 AM

To me, this is a better location than 14 town houses. PS 261 is nearby and there is a great new playground and park across the street with tennis courts and sprinklers in the summer. You are a block from Smith Street, the F train and not too far from other subways too. I live near by and these projects are just not that bad. They are kinda ugly, but I never feel like it's dangerous or has a menacing vibe walking by.

The 14 Townhouses are a few blocks from everything but I think that will change. For now, they are smack in the middle of a construction site -- something new going in direclty behind them and The Smith going up in front. The corner of State and Smith to the west will also be built on. So they could literally be surrounded by pounding construction noise. I wouldn't pay $2.6 million for a house to live in a construction zone.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 14, 2006 10:16 AM

I think this house is beautiful. I doubt I could live in it (even if I could afford it), it seems like I'd have to throw out all my stuff and make sure my kid never actually played with his toys to live up to its modernist ideal... To tell the truth, I'm a little intimidated by houses like these. But it is beautiful.

The privacy walls on either side in the back look a little odd, but I guess you can't have the neighbors checking you out when the blinds are up.

And it was very smart of the broker to take a picture of the back of it at dusk. An all-glass house looks gorgeous when it's glowing at night...

To all the "flipper" and "reno" comments: this is a brand new house, I don't think those terms apply, right? Unless you can "flip" and "reno" an empty lot.

Posted by: sylvia at November 14, 2006 10:16 AM

That playground previous poster mentioned in next block north (on Baltic) not across the street.
And Baltic St. block is a construction zone right now. 3 sights being developed and application for a 4th.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 14, 2006 10:51 AM

I walk down this block nearly every day. I don't think the Gowanus Houses feel threatening either but you're crazy if you don't stay away from them at night. Talk to the precinct. Seriously, with all the new city people, mostly under 40, in Cobble Hill and Carroll Gardens in the last 5 years, I am really frightened that there is going to be a real tragedy near the Houses sometime soon. Don't be a bigot but don't be stupid. The decent people in the Houses stay inside past 9 or so. You shd take a cue.

Posted by: Anonymous at November 15, 2006 11:29 PM

Is it that it's 1/2 a block from the projects? It's been on the market over a year...It's beautiful, but is it the neighborhood?

Posted by: guest at August 16, 2007 12:23 PM

« 70 Lefferts' Reprieve Only 40 Days Zipi Zape Reigns as the City's Best Tapas Joint »

November 13, 2006

House of the Day: Going Back to Cali

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