Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

You are simply not going to find fresher food anywhere than at the PS Food Coop. The store turns over its entire inventory more than 52 times a year. Produce in particular turns over at an amazing clip (and I know -- my job is stocking the produce aisle). Organic produce sells for the same price as conventional produce anywhere else. The savings, if you are someone who wants to eat primarily organic, are tremendous.

However, as has been pointed out above, the Coop is about more than money, and I don't doubt that this is part of what agitates some people so much. The Coop is a philosophical enterprise -- cooperation is at the heart of the mission statement. And the Coop is also about a changed relationship to the food supply. Think of it as a gigantic community supported agriculture program, or as a farmer's market. We have "our" farmers who grow almost exclusively for the Coop. And the Coop operates as a community center, with various seminars and events throughout the year.

If none of these other aspects of the Coop appeal to you, you probably shouldn't join -- you'll just get annoyed.

I would never want to allow non-working memberships at the Coop. Yes, it would probably completely overwhelm the store, but more importantly, it would be tampering with an extremely successful organization. I don't think it's an accident that the PSFC has lasted this long. Coops that have a two-tiered membership structure and inherently weaker than working coops. Working at the coop generates a sense of ownership that paying a membership fee can never approximate.

And Dave -- yeah, I'm sure there are cheaters at the Coop. There are cheaters everywhere. And? If I shopped at a regular store, does that mean I should be mad that I have to pay -- just because some people steal? I don't see what your point is.

Posted by: SPer at August 20, 2008 1:40 PM in response to Fort Greene Co-Op Chooses Toiling

I'm a long-term coop member (my member ID number is only 4 digits) and I strongly oppose reducing the work requirement until every check-out station is fully staffed at all times! Ditto for the two for one make-up rule. People have been bitching about the work requirement since forever, but forget that a growing membership means a growing need for member labor (because more sales = mor work to do), aas well as an opportunity to be creative with member labor. For example, the cart walking service didn't exist five years ago and now is available most of the time -- a result of the creative allocation of member labor.

Most of the complaints about member labor being a waste (ie "there's nothing to do on my shift") are a result of allocation problems. Also, there will always be a need for redundancy in member labor -- it's inherently less reliable than paid labor.

I disagree that member labor doesn't promote a sense of ownership and community. Many members become friends with others on their shift and come to a sense of ownership of the coop through the experience of running it, even for that brief and relatively infrequent 2.5 hrs/month.

Posted by: SPer at August 20, 2008 6:42 PM in response to Fort Greene Co-Op Chooses Toiling

Benson -- the fact is I don't make enough money to buy exclusively organic at Whole Foods or Fairway or Union Market. Good for you if you do, but plenty of us don't. The coop does a very good job of making organic food affordable to me. You appear to believe that everybody within range of the Coop is extremely well-off. You're wrong.

Posted by: SPer at August 20, 2008 10:50 PM in response to Fort Greene Co-Op Chooses Toiling

Inigo --

You would be a happier person if you stopped entertaining yourself by posting insulting remarks on the internet.

Thanks to everyone else who responded.
Lauren

Posted by: SPer at September 18, 2008 5:04 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

Bolder --
May I ask, was that 5K per apartment unit or 5K per line (ie, per dumbwaiter shaft)?
Thanks again,
Lauren

Posted by: SPer at September 18, 2008 5:06 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

Bolder --
May I ask, was that 5K per apartment unit or 5K per line (ie, per dumbwaiter shaft)?
Thanks again,
Lauren

Posted by: SPer at September 18, 2008 5:06 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

It is surprising how some people are allergic to the truth, and sage advice. You do not need anyone in your building (much less 100%) to approve the conversion of your dumbwaiter into a closet, unless of course your building actually still uses the dumbwaiter in which case you should be part of the smithsonian. Honestly, it is not bad enough to be so ignorant and naive, but also to be so rude, tsk tsk Lauren.

Posted by: Inigo at September 18, 2008 8:15 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

The first response is right. They need to be fire rated (4 hours, I think) and have some structural improvements so that if you step into the closet you don't fall through.

Posted by: superstooper at September 19, 2008 12:32 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

Oh, the pointing part -an engineer is what you need.

http://www.rsapc.com/

Posted by: superstooper at September 19, 2008 12:34 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

Look, it's not rocket science. If there were no co-op board involved, any handyman could do it in a day. Obviously the issue is when you do it to permit, it's more complicated.

If superstooper is correct about the fire-rating, it's ironic that the dumbwaiter shaft, as originally installed, is a great chimney for fire and is OK; if stopped up, it has to have 4-hour rating??

Posted by: cmu at September 19, 2008 3:56 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

Price was 5k per unit. But we only have 10 units. Would probably be less for a bigger building.

that was assuming we kept the frame and just turned the dumb waiters into pantries. To completely rip out the whole structure I imagine would be substantially more.

The cost would probably also depend on what an engineer found upon inspection, i.e. phone and gas lines running the shaft, for instance, a not-uncommon occurrence.

Posted by: Bolder at September 19, 2008 8:23 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

I must agree with Marion and Bolder, its pricey but yet all worth it. Contact my Contractor and ask him. They also have there own Architectural firm or someone from his family is, I cant remember.

IEB @ 718.204.2552

PK

Posted by: Bklyn1 at September 20, 2008 4:12 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?

Wow, inigo you aren't very polite. I hope the rest of your day is better, after your anger management class.

Posted by: bklyn_girl at September 20, 2008 7:51 PM in response to Closing Up a Dumbwaiter?