Found: company that installs hydronic electric radiant plus cooling
I posted here a while back about my interest in a heat pump + radiator system, which is common in Europe but uncommon here. I was told by various contractors and plumbers that they don’t exist, that they are not efficient, that they don’t work in cold climates, that they won’t work in a whole house–all of which puzzled me since they are routinely installed in big old houses in cold regions like Scandinavia and the UK.
Anyway… I finally found a new company right here in Brooklyn run by a guy who is very knowledgeable and very passionate about these European-style “air to water” systems. It’s called BK Climate Solutions, and I just put down a deposit.
It uses a heat pump like for mini-splits but connects to water-filled pipes for radiators or radiant floors. It also heats your water and pumps out cold air for cooling in summer, except instead of those fat units on the wall, the air comes from very slim slits on the wall or grates on the floor. (Obviously easier as part of a major reno when walls are open.)
Yes, it’s way more expensive than a mini-split system, but there are big rebates available through Con Ed and through NYSERDA’s EmPower + program (if you qualify as moderate income, which for Kings County is defined as less than $101,800). And it apparently costs less to run than a mini-split because it’s even more efficient.
Article about the owner’s own renovation and heat system is here: https://www.achrnews.com/articles/153824-project-files-episode-65-zero-emission-hydronic-heat-at-brooklyn-brownstone
I can’t say yet what it’s like to live with, but thought I’d pass this along in case anyone is interested.
annissa12
in Heating and Cooling 10 months ago
25
1202
Please log in, in order to post replies!
25 replies
Guest User | 10 months ago
Artic is the only North American heat pump that can deliver a high enough temperature for standard radiators.., but again, small btu output compared to gas, and pretty pricey…
https://www.arcticheatpumps.com/high-temperature-heat-pump.html?gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIgojv2P63gwMVyWlHAR2LowHlEAAYAiAAEgISkfD_BwE
Guest User | 10 months ago
You could also use a residential chiller like the Chiltrix Cx50… but again the maximum temperature output limits the system to fan coils or radiant heat unless you integrate a hydronic boiler into the system. Also the btu heating output of each cx50 is merely 57000 btu
Augustiner | 10 months ago
The nay-sayers here are always quick to smash any glimmer of enthusiasm.
As far as I know there will be no new gas lines for new construction or major renovations from January 2024. So it is essential to find out more about ‘all electric’ heating solutions that go beyond the common hvac wall mount unit.
And any system that uses water instead of r410 is a smart investment because it is easier to maintain than proprietary decentralized hvac gear.
Guest User | 10 months ago
Taco system m appears to generate a maximum temp water flow of 140 degrees, too low for standard radiators… it’s rated only for radiant heat or air handlers…
justinromeu26 | 10 months ago
Countrymouse, this topic and questions about the efficiency of these things came up on here a few months back with people referencing units used in europe. I lived with heat pumps in north carolina in the 1980s and was aware that these will work to a point (about freezing) at which time an expensive to operate heat coil kicks in. Understanding that technolgy has improved since the 1980s and that europe has become a leader in green technology, i began digging around to find out what is going on and as with everything else where marketing is involved or someone has an agenda to drive, there is a lot that people do not tell us about what we are being sold. With the european products, i decided to pull the technical data from a product made in the UK. The first thing i read in their marketing material was that their product will “not work in places like Canada without auxiliary heat”. As i dug deeper into their technical data i learned that these machines work better than what i used in the 1980s but that from about 28 F to 11 F they work with decreasing efficien cy until at 11 F they must rely entirely on an auxiliary heat source and that source is often an electric wire type device that chews electricity (when that device kicked in where i was living in the 1980s, i ran outside and looked at the electric meter; it was spinning like a top). The Taco unit you mention works down to about 7 F. I am not sure how well it works as the temperature drops from say 32f to 7f.
During my research, i made a call to a friend in europe asking him what they install in their houses. The regular joe over there is sort of where many of us are at here with this stuff. They know about it and are watching it but are not 100% sold on it. The guy i spoke to who considers himself to be green and makes it his life to do the best he can (better than most people at the same socioeconomic and education level here would do), had just installed a modern and smaller gas boiler. It was not like our old cast iron junk, but it was still a gas boiler (like one of these little bosch units we see hanging in closets here).
Others in this debate on here a few months back said it might be good to keep our old heating systems if we were to install heat pumps. To that point, i recently did a home inspection on a newly renovated house that had been upgraded in every respect. No expense had been spared on green technology. And what did they do? They installed heat pumps AND a brand new gas boiler with radiant floor heating/pex (they did not simply leave their 30 year old cast iron junk like i would do). There was a reason they did this.
I might poke around later and do some more research into Taco and their performance and also read about scandanavian systems to see if they are doing something we don’t know about.
Also, when dealing with contractors, the most important thing they are telling you is not what they are saying but what they are not saying. Do your own research.